Does any one know what the purpose of the valve cover breather really is? some people have the hose that goes from the valve cover to the intake, and other s have the breather on the valve cover and they seal off the hose on the intake. Whats the difference.?
Valve Cover Breather Debate
Wickedintegra
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This is probably the best way of doing it, this way, it pulls a vacuum and removes the gasses, but doesnt send them back into your intake piping (and in my case, through the turbo).StyleTEG on Feb/01/06 said:
Did you have a lot more oil consumption or did the catch can catch most of it? Also, you should have been pulling more vacuum than that at WOT unless it was too far downstream your exhaust or you didnt have enough exhaust velocity...
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I'm concerned about this, because when I bought my gsr, it had the breather on it. I was always concerned about it because I've never seen one of them on another honda. So after I saw this thread, and saw people telling remove the breather, I did a search and found this thread. Now I didn't read all 8 pages, but I skimmed through it. And from what I'm getting is that either keep the hose that runs from the intake to the valve cover, or get a ENDYN catch can kit. Am I correct?
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for those of you just joining in on this thread, please read this thread from page 1 instead of jumping in at page 7 and disregarding the first part.
we debated whether Endyn's idea that a valve cover breather at the hookup point to the intake hose causes more blow by or not.
it depends on engine load (idle, part throttle, WOT) as to whether the air sucks into the valve cover or blows out.
if you look at the serious racers , they run 2 breathers out the front of the valve cover to lower windage losses and create lower crankcase pressures at WOT.
That's how you should approach looking at this problem: what happens under different loads and what are you trying accomplish at the crankcase to have less blow by at the rings at a specific engine load. If you race a lot then WOT is a concern whereas if you have a street car, you are at part throttle more often.
Secondly the catch can is a separate issue from the valve cover breather that is replacing the intake hose line. It's a way to vent the system while being able to lower contaminating oil vapors going into the IM and affecting detonation and facilitating this crankcase pressure relief.
cobra, Ross:
I think that's what I learned through the years that Endyn's explanation of the valve cover breather replacing the intake hose line to the valve cover is correct but incomplete since it doesn't explain all conditions.
running a crankcase vacuum pump is pretty impractical though. in dry sump systems you need to run a couple pumps and I don't know if it's legal in some series if you plan to race the car. running a dry sump system on the street with a crankcase vacuum is pretty high maintenance and impractical but if you are dedicated enough to put up with the hassle of maintaining it then it is an option.
Porsche is the only street car that I know that uses a dry sump crankcase vacuum system on a producttion car.
I'm more concerned about whether the crankcase oil gets to the pickup in the pan and gets circulated to the oil pump under high cornering G's and starvation even with a baffled pan and that's why we looked into the accusump system as an option.
we debated whether Endyn's idea that a valve cover breather at the hookup point to the intake hose causes more blow by or not.
it depends on engine load (idle, part throttle, WOT) as to whether the air sucks into the valve cover or blows out.
if you look at the serious racers , they run 2 breathers out the front of the valve cover to lower windage losses and create lower crankcase pressures at WOT.
That's how you should approach looking at this problem: what happens under different loads and what are you trying accomplish at the crankcase to have less blow by at the rings at a specific engine load. If you race a lot then WOT is a concern whereas if you have a street car, you are at part throttle more often.
Secondly the catch can is a separate issue from the valve cover breather that is replacing the intake hose line. It's a way to vent the system while being able to lower contaminating oil vapors going into the IM and affecting detonation and facilitating this crankcase pressure relief.
cobra, Ross:
I think that's what I learned through the years that Endyn's explanation of the valve cover breather replacing the intake hose line to the valve cover is correct but incomplete since it doesn't explain all conditions.
running a crankcase vacuum pump is pretty impractical though. in dry sump systems you need to run a couple pumps and I don't know if it's legal in some series if you plan to race the car. running a dry sump system on the street with a crankcase vacuum is pretty high maintenance and impractical but if you are dedicated enough to put up with the hassle of maintaining it then it is an option.
Porsche is the only street car that I know that uses a dry sump crankcase vacuum system on a producttion car.
I'm more concerned about whether the crankcase oil gets to the pickup in the pan and gets circulated to the oil pump under high cornering G's and starvation even with a baffled pan and that's why we looked into the accusump system as an option.
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I think kelly put this link up before and it's not a bad explanation for a foundation or baseline to this thread.
there's several ways to run a catch can for FI and avoid the back firewall breather but I've seen a couple of turbo setups running the dual front valve cover breathers. Endyn is famous for this dual front breather system even in their modified JRSC setup and not only in their NA . They weren't the ones who invented this concept btw.
there's several ways to run a catch can for FI and avoid the back firewall breather but I've seen a couple of turbo setups running the dual front valve cover breathers. Endyn is famous for this dual front breather system even in their modified JRSC setup and not only in their NA . They weren't the ones who invented this concept btw.
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here are some high end catch can breather hookups on racing Bseries turbos:
![Image]()
![Image]()
![Image]()
Back from the dead again:
Recently, I've been going between the following:
1) Valve cover nipple connected to the intake arm
- Oily moisture builds up in the throttle body - obviously not a good thing.
2) Valve cover nipple connected to the endyn catch can
- My catch can fills up much more rapidly - rings aren't sealing as well, as stated in the past several pages.
To try and get the best of both worlds, I've installed a PCV valve in between the hose that connects the valve cover to the intake arm. Obviously, it is set up to only allow air to travel from the intake to the valve cover.
Is there any problems I should be worried about in this setup besides probably having to replace this PCV valve often?
Recently, I've been going between the following:
1) Valve cover nipple connected to the intake arm
- Oily moisture builds up in the throttle body - obviously not a good thing.
2) Valve cover nipple connected to the endyn catch can
- My catch can fills up much more rapidly - rings aren't sealing as well, as stated in the past several pages.
To try and get the best of both worlds, I've installed a PCV valve in between the hose that connects the valve cover to the intake arm. Obviously, it is set up to only allow air to travel from the intake to the valve cover.
Is there any problems I should be worried about in this setup besides probably having to replace this PCV valve often?
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you should not have to change PCV valve often.
intake hose -> valve cover
PCV valve -> IM
catch can lines -> crankcase
I'm not running the PCV from the catch can to the intake manifold like in the endyn directions. Maybe I wasn't clear enough.
PCV valve is in between the valve cover nipple & the intake arm. Direction of air: Intake arm -> valve cover, but PCV closes the other direction. I'm using the open element filter on the endyn catch can.
PCV valve is in between the valve cover nipple & the intake arm. Direction of air: Intake arm -> valve cover, but PCV closes the other direction. I'm using the open element filter on the endyn catch can.
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which may be a source of you dumping oil into your TB.
when the valve cover blows instead of sucks is the PCV valve open or closed ?
when the valve cover blows instead of sucks is the PCV valve open or closed ?
Direction of air is FROM the intake arm INTO the valve cover nipple. I double checked it by blowing on both ends of the PCV valve, not to mention adding clear hose between the intake arm & PCV valve, just so I can visually check that no oil is getting into the TB.
I just want to know if there are any issues with what I've done?
To answer your question, when the valve cover BLOWS air out, PCV valve is closed... when the intake arm blows air INTO the valve cover, PCV valve is open.
I actually didn't try sucking air out of both ends, only blew on both ends, hopefully the final result is the same.
I just want to know if there are any issues with what I've done?
To answer your question, when the valve cover BLOWS air out, PCV valve is closed... when the intake arm blows air INTO the valve cover, PCV valve is open.
I actually didn't try sucking air out of both ends, only blew on both ends, hopefully the final result is the same.
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GunNam on Mar/29/06 said:
why are you doing this ? it makes no sense.
I've never run the PCV valve to the valve cover.
I've always run it to the IM.
how is the PCV valve "sensing" the changes in crankcase pressure then?
you're just getting massive blow by past the rings that way.
you'll notice that for Endyn when they run their PCV valve in that 2 catch can system that they use: the PCV valve goes to the IM. There's a separate intake hose to the valve cover nipple as you call it AND they unload the crankcase pressure using those 2 extra valve cover nipples on the radiator side running to a second catch can.
By placing your PCV valve in between the valve cover and the intake and not the IM, you're just making matters worst and causing more blow by as the throttle position increases.
I haven't welded my bungs into the front of my valve cover yet, nor have I ordered another catchcan... it'll happen soon, but I haven't decided on a catch can yet.
I did this today because I noticed that with the hose connecting the valve cover nipple to the catch can, my can was filling up rapidly. With the hose connecting the intake arm to the valve cover nipple (stock setup), I was getting oily build-up in my TB.
I haven't been using any PCV valves with my catch can setup. I've had my breather set up in the "off road" configuration without the drainback feature.
I did this today because I noticed that with the hose connecting the valve cover nipple to the catch can, my can was filling up rapidly. With the hose connecting the intake arm to the valve cover nipple (stock setup), I was getting oily build-up in my TB.
I haven't been using any PCV valves with my catch can setup. I've had my breather set up in the "off road" configuration without the drainback feature.
In the Endyn setup with the PCV valve on top of the catch can, it is venting the blowby gas back into the intake manifold, which is what I don't want to do...
and with the stock setup with a hose connecting the intake arm to the valve cover nipple, I'm getting build up in my TB...
Maybe I should hurry up and buy that second catch can...
and with the stock setup with a hose connecting the intake arm to the valve cover nipple, I'm getting build up in my TB...
Maybe I should hurry up and buy that second catch can...
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so what? the baffles in the can are catching the oil vapor and therefore less is going into the IM.GunNam on Mar/30/06 said:
on your setup, you're dumping oil into the IM anyway causing more risk of detonation , plus you're getting ,massive blow-by.
trust me on this one: you don't need a second can. Just hook the 1 that you have up correctly.
I have mine setup in the "off-road" configuration with the open element filter on top of the can, hose between the intake arm and the valve cover nipple.
When you say "hook the 1 that you have up correctly," are you saying to hook it up in the street legal configuration? - emissions friendly version?
When you say "hook the 1 that you have up correctly," are you saying to hook it up in the street legal configuration? - emissions friendly version?
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yep..the off road one without the PCV valve isn't great for part throttle around town piston ring sealing, if you know what I mean,...it's meant for WOT. run the valve to the IM.
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GunNam on Mar/30/06 said:I haven't welded my bungs into the front of my valve cover yet, nor have I ordered another catchcan... it'll happen soon, but I haven't decided on a catch can yet.
I did this today because I noticed that with the hose connecting the valve cover nipple to the catch can, my can was filling up rapidly. With the hose connecting the intake arm to the valve cover nipple (stock setup), I was getting oily build-up in my TB.
I haven't been using any PCV valves with my catch can setup. I've had my breather set up in the "off road" configuration without the drainback feature.
Make your own to whatever configuration you want.
No welding required.
DIY catch can
My first one:
![Image]()
My second one
Quote: By me here is the test fit of the top fitting. this could be used one of two ways, etiher with a breather filter as shown, or run a vacuum line to the intake manifold for a closed loop.
![Image]()
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