[nakago76]

hi, i'm currently looking at a sway bar upgrade. For the past month or so i've read up on the type-r bar and the BSQ kit. That idea has stuck with me, however i do have a concern with that upgrade that I hope you all can help me with.

I have an LS so i have stock a 22mm front and a 13mm rear. now if I upgrade the rear to the 22mm type-r do i run the risk of it being too stiff in the rear as compared to the front (oversteer) I don't want to exchange one problem for the other. I see my options as upgrading my front to a 24 (gsr bar) along with the 22mm type-r rear, or just going with a 19mm rear Suspension Tech bar instead of the Type-r and keeping my front 22mm bar.

So what all do you think, and more importantly can if i go with the type-r and GSR bars can i even use the GSR front bar on my 94LS? I haven't seen any post that cover is that is possible or if there is a mounting kit that is needed, or what all is involved with a front upgrade.

Thanks in advance

 

[StyleTEG]

I am pretty sure the GSR bar is bolt in with out any mounting kit.

 

[nakago76]

wow that was a fast reply styleteg.

yeah see i'm thinking it should but just cause i think it should doesn't mean it will. I assume i would only need to buy the bar, bushings, and bushing brackets to upgrade the front bar. My current endlinks and bolts should be ok, right?

 

[dragontegz]

i have a stock front and an itr rear. no oversteer problems yet. i think it would be a little tougher than that to have a fwd car oversteer to a point of being a problem....

 

[StyleTEG]

Hmm, the endlinks & bushings should be fine. There is room on the endlink rods for a larger bar if necissary. Though while you are at it you may want to replace all the bushing with polyurethane ones. Its only $20 per bar (sway bushings, and endlink bushings), and you will be pulling out the old ones anyways.

 

[dragontegz]

about the bushings, brett who makes the mounting kits for itr upgrade says that, for the rear at least, the stock bushings will do fine because they're as hard as the polyurethane ones and they don't squeak like the polyurethane ones do. the front ones, i would definitely replace with polyurethane ones...

 

[BlueTeg]

A.) With only the itr 22mm rear swaybar, you won't be too stiff. I have a 22mm rear swaybar and I have no problems w/ unwanted oversteer.

B.) I would stick w/ the itr rear swaybar and if you have money left over upgrade to the gsr front sway w/ some poly bushings like StyleTeg suggested.

C.) The GSR front sway will in fact bolt right up to your LS w/ the right oem mounting hardware taken off the GSR.

 

[nakago76]

So the overstear may not be as big an issue as i was reading about. however i do race in some autoX events, so would that extra stress make any control problems more apparent? Also would the BSQ kit really be tough enough for autox?

the only advantage i see to the 19mm suspension Tech bar is that it would be a onetime thing (shouldn't have to upgrade my front ever, i've already but poly bushing on it) and its made for the car, not made to fit the car.

I'm out for an upgrade that will help my handeling, make it more neutral.

Guess i have some more pricing and thinking to do. but thanks for the info.

 

[dragontegz]

brett says that he's had his for a long time and he does autox also and he's nad no problems with subframe tearouts so far. this is coming from a guy who makes the mounting kit and sells them to people for really cheap. (i don't believe he really makes any profit from it either.) a lot of people have done this mod and i haven't really heard anything about tearouts either - only about people worrying about it.

 

[BlueTeg]

So the overstear may not be as big an issue as i was reading about. however i do race in some autoX events, so would that extra stress make any control problems more apparent? Also would the BSQ kit really be tough enough for autox?

the only advantage i see to the 19mm suspension Tech bar is that it would be a onetime thing (shouldn't have to upgrade my front ever, i've already but poly bushing on it) and its made for the car, not made to fit the car.

I'm out for an upgrade that will help my handeling, make it more neutral.

Guess i have some more pricing and thinking to do. but thanks for the info.

People hype up the oversteer from the 22mm upgrade way too much. Think about it.....the Type R comes w/ the 22mm bar stock! Even though the car is geared towards people who are going to be racing the car...they still have to engineer a certain amount of safety for those who can afford an R but shouldn't necessarily be put behind the wheel of such a machine. Honda would never release a car to the public if it had severe oversteer, as this would be disasterous when unexperienced drivers encounter a situation where they have to make drastic steering manuvers. (read: the R handles neutral vs. the gsr or ls which has the tendency to "plow" through hard corners).

If you are serious about autocrossing I wouldn't worry too much about getting the gsr front swaybar as this will only decrease the amount of rotation that the car will have in a turn. The opposite of what you want when autocrossing.

If I were in your shoes I would setup and get the itr 22mm bar w/ the mounting hardware. You can always add on the gsr bar if you want more understeer.

 

[phoenix]

Forgive me for sounding nieve but what is the cage roll difference between oversteer and understeer?
As far as i knew the bigger the sway bar the less roll, which is was is optimal right?

 

[BlueTeg]

oversteer = the tail is more susceptable to coming around in a corner. The rear tires lose traction before the front do.

understeer = the front of the car is more likely to "push" going through a corner. The front tires loose traction before the rear.

Here is an excellenc article that details swaybars.
click here for sway bar info

 

[phoenix]

Thanks BlueTeg
I've read that one a few times but it didn't say what the differences were
Thanks much for the info

 

[nakago76]

blueteg why do you have to make such good points in your reply Its true they made the type-r with a 24 and a 22 for a reason, my thinking is cause its a great set up. so why not go for the 22 and if need be I'll get a 24 bar down the road.