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Discussion Starter #1
I have b18c and I would like to know which of the Drag gen3 turbo kit or F-max turbo will give me the best horsepower and reliability.
 

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That is such a VAUGE question..I could say...Apples are better than Oranges...What are your goals ? What are you trying to do ? Auto-X ? Drag ? It's not all in the kit...Some are better suited than others...Give us some details and we shall do out best to help ya...Have you read our Articles section on Turbos ? That's a good place to start, then hit us up for questions after you have read those...Remember what are YOU wanting to do....
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Ok then. I want a daily driven car with approx 260-280 horsepower and if possible without to much lag torquey troughout the powerband and reliable... of course.
 

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Both those kits come with a T3/T4. So as far as turbo lag it's going to be there. Those HP numbers are not bad if your talking @ the flywheel but if your talking WHP your going to have to crank up the boost. Canceling out your reliable request. You would be best off with a ball bearing turbo if you want that kind of power and quick spool up. I know FMAX has the option to upgrade to a ball bearing. The place is about a mile from my house. The guy there is cool. They are a bit pricy though, but I guess you get what you pay for. Good luck. Hope you don't blow your engine like I did..
 

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Reliable... of course! For 260-280WHP ? Pay now ! Or pay later..Build your internals it's all there in the Turbo 101 Article, all ya need to know.

Nothing wrong with shooting for the moon but you have to add some realstic common sense to the approach...It's not slap on a kit that advertises 100-200hp and presto ! First off they are stating gains to the flywheel !

Tune, Tune, Tune ! And you may gain 260-280whp with bigger injectors a T3-T4 and pistons and rods VictorX manifold etc. and more importantly, with the proper A/F ratio...Maybe even 300whp ! But that is gonna add another 2k+ easy ! The standard kit FMU may not cut it...You may need a Hondata or AEM EMS to get you there ! If so, slap on another $600-$1500 ! Not to mention what it will cost in Dyno time ! You can swap the disc in the "Kit FMU" to 8:1 or 10:1 and it may give/restrict the fuel you need or dont need...Like I said TUNE ! A/F needs to be perfect !
But "Reliable" means = Tuning = $$$$$ my friend !!

Good luck !
 

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I don't like the way BoostControl sometimes don't answer the question straight up. I mean I was wondering the same thing as Chicboup. F-Max says that Drag systems does not contain the quality that their systems are built with. Maybe BoostControl should start with that fact and expound from there. Say things like "Drag only offers one stage while F-Maxx offers 3 stages". If you are looking to drag race, then the Drag is the best bang for your buck, but if you looking for daily street and auto x, the go with F-Maxx... blah blah blah. The turbo article on scratches the surface of turbo theory. People like me want to know more. More of what... more of ET times (estimated) and WHP (estimated of course). Especially more of packages. For instance like to get to run 11's and get 500 HP you'll need: Turbo + intercooler kit ($3000), Cylinder wall ($800), MSD ($400), NOS 100+ shot ($650), Pistons ($580), Rods ($350, victor X intake manifold ($300). cams ($400), and springs ($120). THat is a good example!!
 

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BoostControl Don't think I don't like you. I actually do and I have read everyone of your articles and most of your response of the Forums



 

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jahbugz on Sep/13/02 said:
I don't like the way BoostControl sometimes don't answer the question straight up. I mean I was wondering the same thing as Chicboup. F-Max says that Drag systems does not contain the quality that their systems are built with. Maybe BoostControl should start with that fact and expound from there. Say things like "Drag only offers one stage while F-Maxx offers 3 stages". If you are looking to drag race, then the Drag is the best bang for your buck, but if you looking for daily street and auto x, the go with F-Maxx... blah blah blah. The turbo article on scratches the surface of turbo theory. People like me want to know more. More of what... more of ET times (estimated) and WHP (estimated of course). Especially more of packages. For instance like to get to run 11's and get 500 HP you'll need: Turbo + intercooler kit ($3000), Cylinder wall ($800), MSD ($400), NOS 100+ shot ($650), Pistons ($580), Rods ($350, victor X intake manifold ($300). cams ($400), and springs ($120). THat is a good example!!
WOW ! I am here to help you but I can not hold your hand and do all the work for you...I also can't answer EVERY QUESTIoN THE WAY YOU SEE FIT....Think for yourself !
If you don't like the Articles... I have said many, many times..."You find ACURATE SPECS AND INFO FEEL FREE TO ADD THEM !" If you find a better way... EXCELLENT ! SHARE IT !

Your questions jahbugz are somewhat ridiculous... And sounds like you want/need someone to think for you and do all the work ! And if you would like I can do that ! They don't make a kit for any specific type of application ! Its a TURBO ! It's how you build and tune your setup around the turbo SIZE that applies to what you're going for...Sure the size of the turbo IN THE KIT MATTERS and applies with different results.

If you want me to build you a turbo setup...No problem ! You want 11"s ? No problem ! You and I can pay a visit to Bob Norwood @ Autocraft Inc. and we can build you a holy roller of a turbo setup ! You got the cash ?

Please by all means if you want to add to the Articles FIRE AWAY PLEASE ! There is a reason it just touches upon "Turbo Theory"...It's called "Individualism <--Big word ! This is RESEARCH a lot of people have done...And you too can do the same ! And because everyone has different goals and setups...We can't cover every single way to run a TURBO ! Everyone has different goals and dreams...For a fee I can live those out for you if you would like....

Good luck to you !
 

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You want facts ? Whats the BEST ?

REV-HARD ! HKS ! *LOL*


You want 500whp ? Re-sleeve the block with Golden Eagle sleeves. JG Pro Series head...a T66 Add 25-30+psi and hope to GOD you can drive it ! While your at it maybe a bag of GOLD will drop out of the sky and plunk you in the head so that you can pay for all of it !

You want something that takes a helluva lot of know how and experience summed up in a paragraph it's just not possible there are way to many variables involved ! Keep dreaming...
 

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BoostControl. My questions are not rediculous. and I have read your articles and as a matter of fact they have helped me to understand about target goals and different setups and basic turbo theory. The only thing I said was that you didn't get down into the nitty gritty of the subject. I do not want to be spoon fed information. As a matter of fact I joined this site for the specific purpose of reading your article. (I typed in turbo info in a search engine and it gave me this site). So here am I. I log in EVERDAY and try to squeeze as much information that I can get (especially about turbos) from this site and other sites. I'm just here to learn, but sometimes it seems that some of you guys with the know how wants us to go learn it ourselves or something. The last reply was good. Now I know what to do to get 500whp. See I didn't even know REV-Hard was the best. Now when I'm going to purchase a kit, I'll ask for Rev-Hard and dyno tune my car with Bob Norwood. I will spend the cash.
 

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I think he was being sarcastic..since he said rev hard then HKS. Since HKS has yet to make a kit for our cars (though one's in the works) It's true though. Some times people get to the point where they feel like you should make the same mistakes and learn the hard way. I personaly like to share any information I have learned over the years to maybe help some one from making the same mistakes I have. And hope maybe some day some one will give me advice that will save me a headache they went through. There really does seem to be a lot of people saying that is a rideculous question and read the articals (more so with turbo questions) but I think that is because turbos are so much different than the usual I/H/E we are used to. But I think that we should help these people (you don't have to hold their hand just give them some direction) If some one asked you for directions to a town do you say "The 7-11 right there sells maps. I suggest you use one"? or do you say "Just go down that road and take a left then a right"? I am one of those who does the later of the two. We are here to help and be helped. It all comes around and goes around. I know they say well I can't help everyone and they keep asking the same questions. Well maybe just let some one else answer then. And if nobody wants to answer then they will just look some where else. I don't think anyone hasn't looked at the articals and hasn't ran a search. So telling them to do so is pointless. Sorry just a suggestion. Let's be positive everybody
 

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can we get back to the main topic please?

Chicboup on Sep/11/02 said:
I have b18c and I would like to know which of the Drag gen3 turbo kit or F-max turbo will give me the best horsepower and reliability.
both of them will be equally reliable as boh are reputable companies-- if you are looking to make massive horse for drag purposes all you have to do on either kit is add a boost controller and turn it up -- but in this case as BOOSTCoNTROL says it must be tuned and built--
stock internals can handle up to 275-280 WHP without rebuilding but for how long and how many runs---
maybe 5-6 at the track one night at this level-- then you start to cause damage--

Both kits are set at a reasonable 7psi level for daily use-- one (i cant remember right now loses A/C)this was valuable to me so i went with Greddy-- spools a bit earlier than these kits because of the way the turbo is made(big housing little turbo-- spools fast and can make up to 25psi if needed)

If you want massive horse you need to be ready to spend money-- if you want to have a little fun on the weekends any kit will be reliable on low boost if you have enough fuel....refer to Boostcontrols first post for fuel info----
 

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I was not trying to be rude...It's just almost impossible to answer those kinda of questions. I tried pointing that out. It's not quite as black and white as asking for directions...I wish it was !

If it's a drag car ANYoNE wants its the size of the turbo and if the motors internals are built or not that it comes down to ! Rev-Hard seems to win this hands down...Not to say it's better really that's just my opinion. They are doing some great new re-designs that SHOULD put them above the rest of the "Kit Builders" soon ! HKS is also in R&D to give a kit for our car ! You can bet it will be a helluva kit they are a top notch company with an outstanding R&D dept.

I am here to help any and all...NO need to make it personal...I respond accordingly...And I will state again : If ANYoNE wants to add anything to the Articles...Just make sure it's accurate specs and info ! I gave the basics hince why the title is called Turbo 101 ! And I have shared ALL of my trials and errors here to do just that HELP ! If anyone can say this I know I can...I can dam sure tell ya how and what NOT to do on turbos ! *LOL*

Remember a few things...Our cars where NEVER meant to be turboed first of all ! 2nd : It is a Black Art that has PROVEN results but like anything to do with modifying cars, "sh*t Happens" ! You dont have to look any further than the NHRA Hot Rod class to see that in action both GOOD & BAD ! There are things and ways "To do and NOT to do" ! I have said it time and time again...Tune ! Pay now or Pay later the choice is yours !
 

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TRUST ME PEOPLE BOSTCoNTROL TO THE MOMENT HAS BEEN THE BEST HELP, PUT IT THIS WAY HE SAVE ME $3500 FROM A SHOP THAT WAS TRYING TO RIP ME OFF
 

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jahbugz on Sep/12/02 said:
go with f-maxx stage III. Your ET times will be LOWWWWW!!
I hate to be the one who stirs this all up again but jahbugz if you look at your post above....

Now you started to flame BoostControl with this reply saying that "I don't like the way BoostControl sometimes don't answer the question straight up".....that being said do you think that your first reply that said "go with f-maxx stage III. Your ET times will be LOWWWWW!!"..is answering the question "straight up"????

Personally I think that you need to calm down and quit with the whining and complaning about BoostControls reply. If you go back and look at what he said about getting to the horsepower goal that Chicboup wanted (260-280 to the wheels) you will see that he did answer the question. The answer is not which one of those kits to get but how to get there PERIOD...regardless of what kit you buy!!

Chicboup did not ask "How do I get 500hp, and also I need to know all the parts to get that, and oh by the way while you are at it please give me all the prices and where to buy them as well."

My suggestion to you jahbugz is that if you do not believe that BoostControl answered the question fully, then by all means feel free to add to the thread but don't interupt a whole thread to ***** and moan about someone's reply...especially when that someone is one of the most helpful members here for turbos. And if you find out that adding to the thread does not solve your problem them private message him with your concerns..don't publicly flame someone because YOU did not like the answer he gave.

Oh and PS...if you are wondering why I chose to air my comments out publicy and not private message you..here's my answer......I am hoping that more people other than yourself will see my suggestion so that we can cut down on the amount of "flame" posts here....after all, aren't we all here to learn and help each other out???
 

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What ever happened to the HKS kit? I saw it in a magazine like over a year ago and never herd anything since. Is it going to be released soon. I agree with boostcontrol HKS makes some nice stuff. Maybe they will force all the other kits to step up the quality. The only quality kit right now is the Greddy and you have to sacrifice the power. HKS has never sacrificed power for quality. They just charge more so you can have both. Oh and I wasn't flamming I just thought he was being sarcastic about which kit was best. Oh and the directions to get to 280 HP Reliable St is take the T4 south 5 miles exit on Built Internal Ln. At the first intersection take a right on Tunning Ave. Just keep on tunning till your there.
 

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I appologize TI and all its members. And as I said in my previous post, BoostControl saved me time and money too. He is the reason why I signed up to be a memeber. I liked his turbo articles, but just wished he'd add some more to them. (I'M NOT RUSHING OR PRESSURING HIM).
 

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You guys talk about greedy being a more reliable turbo but with less power then rev-hard or drag. I want a reliable turbo, so would it be better to get greedy or to run low boost on a drag or rev-hard? Which would be faster and more reliable? Or would it be smarter to get a jrsc how would the power differ from the other ideas?
 

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I think it would be better for you to read the turbo 101 article, then try using the search function (VERY USEFULL). Then if you have any further questions, start your own thread. Don't jump into someone's thread to ask a question unless of course that question has already been answered.
 
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