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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey guys, I was wondering if I could get some comments/suggestions on how to build up the engine in my 2000 GS-R.
I have been reading non stop for a while now, and have the basic mods done to my car - AEM CAI, DC 4-1 header and Greddy Evo cat back. Since the car only has 20k on it, I figure the stock cat isn't a bottleneck in this setup and I'll probably leave that on there for now anyways.

My goal: I want to stay all motor, and am looking at trying to hit about 200whp. (i know peak isn't the most important thing, but it's just a number I am thinking). I'd like my powerband to be in the upper range, around 6000 (or 5500 if possible) all the way up to 8000, without sacrificing a ToN of mid range power (would like to keep that above stock) :)

I am considering the skunk2 stage 1 cams, valve springs and either skunk or AEM adjustable cam gears as my cam setup of choice. It also seems that the skunk2 intake manifold would be a good choice once the cams are installed. For tuning, I am thinking a VAFC.

Am I on the right track?
thanks!
Mike
 

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skunk2 IM = Type R IM

swap out your gsr tranny for a type r w/LSD.. should help you along. VAFC is good for what your trying to do. Lots of tuning for you to do buddy. But it looks as if to me your on the right track..

it's not too hard to get a gsr to make 200 to the wheels..
maybe do a search on past posts.. i know this has been covered quite a few times.. you may get some ideas and find out what mod works and what mod doesnt work with your motor and your specifics.

good luck.
 

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The stock catylic converter IS always a bottle neck, try going for the carsound cat. Either 2.25'' or 2.5'', and since you're aiming for 200 hp, the DC sport 4-1 header might be a little restrictive too. Look for a 2.5'' collector, and mate it with a 2.5'' cat and finish it with a 2.5'' exhaust.

Also, if you're looking for 200 whp. the skunk 2 stage 1 cam's might not be sufficient enough.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
The reason I want my powerband so high is because I like to go to the track, and that is the area where you spend most of your time under hard accellaration.

Would the stage 2 cams be a better choice then? keeping in mind this is also my daily driver, I don't want to completely destroy fuel economy or street drivability.

(also, done lots of searching and couldn't find anything too specific)
 

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well what is your budget like?

Have you ever looked into JUN or TODA SPECS?
They are a little pricey, but they are great for NA setups with the powerband your looking for.

read THIS... the article is by michael delaney.. it's very informative and will probably help you along alot more than us giving you opinions on what we think the best setup would be..
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Ryan, thanks for the links.. I had missed a couple of those. I kind of got the impression from the last post that the Toda's are very similar to the skunk2's.
My budget it pretty flexible. If it starts to eat up too much coin, then I will just spread my mods out over a longer period of time.. but I dont want to piss away money either by spending too much on a particular mod if there are better options or buying stuff I dont need :)

I'll look into the Jun's some more
 

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remember to choose your mods that fit your powerband.

you don't want a 4-2-1 header with wild cams.
you would want a 4-1 header with a 2.5inch collector like the jdm type r or hytech or smsp even dc sports 4-1..

mixing modifications that benefit low-to midrange power cancels out your higher rpm powerband... meaning they will not benefit at all..

just incase you were thinking a little bit of this and a little bit of that to support low/midrange/and high..

you can only have 1 set powerband unless supercharged.. i think a supercharger will spread throughout all rpms.

but your staying all motor, so thats out of the question.
really good luck man.

i love seeing fine tuned n/a setups at the track. just so crisp.

remember to tune also!
i'll grab a couple of articles for you to suit your tuning needs.. be right back..
 

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dyno tuning basics

why peak who can lie: transient response

chassis dynanometers

air;fuel ratio tuning basics

hp & torque: analyzing power curves


all are very informative..and i strongly encourage you to read thoroughly before starting your n/a application project. and make sure to read some of the exhaust articles which will benefit your engine package..

i also read an article on importreview.com that they tested the smsp header vs the hytech header... the untuned smsp header won hands down over the more expensive TUNED hytech header... SMSP header is supposed to give you somewhere in the range of 30 to the wheels..

check out that site also for LOTS OF DYNO CHARTS!

any Q's, just pm me bro..

cheers
 

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oh yeah.. one more thing..

SMSP is a member on this site.. do a search by member .. his sign name is "SMSP"..se alot of posts by him.

i bough a few things off of him, very good quality stuff! very good business man to deal with. He knows his stuff!

you should really look into his complete 2.5inch exhaust package.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
thanks for all the help!
Unfortunately I started with a 2.25" exhaust package, because I didn't plan on doing as many mods as I have decided I can swing now :)
I will probably complete the main parts of the package, tune, and then go back and upgrade the exhaust again.
I'll be in contact with you! :D
 

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There is absolutely nothing wrong with 4-2-1 header. Like Mugen, Toda, Spoon... etc they are 4-2-1 with 2.5" collector. 4-2-1 are awesome, they also give the best ground clearance, sits higher up then the oil pan, will never see scratches!

Definitely look into Toda Cams! They are awesome! Spec B Toda cams are awesome, definitely need the valve springs and retainers to go with it, either use stock cam gears or aftermarket that shares the similiar teeth pattern or else you will pay dearly! Get the Toda Timing Belt, always a good choice, made of kevlar, not rubber, very strong and durbable.

Swap out your stock bottom pistons in favor of higher compression, something simple like the CTRs are a good choice.

Hondata or some sort of ECU management!!! TUNE TUNE TUNE!!

this will definitely put you into the 200whp range.

it is not cheap that goes for parts and labor, so expect to pay a lot!
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Would the spec B toda's be a little much for a daily driver?
As far as tuning, I think the VAFC2 good considering NA.
And I have relatively cheap labour available to me...

how much do aftermarket cams mess with fuel consumption? Especially the higher lift ones like the B's?
 

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if you aren't wanting to change your pistons then you don't want that much of a long duration cam or else you lose dynamic cr and therefore, power.

the smarter move would be to port enough to make 200 whp and use less cam and have just enough CR to burn all of the mix you get from the porting instead of the cam.

if you want to change the piston, then B's would be fine but otherwise a 10:1 CR GSR and Toda B's = disaster performance and thrown away money.


I think we've thoroughly discussed about dynamic CR in the Common Topics, in MD Tech forum , and in the articles before...there's no need to rehash it.
 

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KRAJYBOI on Feb/17/04 said:
There is absolutely nothing wrong with 4-2-1 header. Like Mugen, Toda, Spoon... etc they are 4-2-1 with 2.5" collector. 4-2-1 are awesome, they also give the best ground clearance, sits higher up then the oil pan, will never see scratches!
correct me if im wrong..
but i was under the assumption that 4-2-1 exhaust manifolds benefit your low to mid-range power?
this guys isnt looking for that kind of power band. 4-1 would be best with a 2.5inch collector to benefit his higher powerband. correct me if im wrong?

I didnt say there was anything wrong with 4-2-1.. just not for his setup, it would be useless..

cheers.
 

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please read the buyer's guide artice and the header tech article. explains everything....I don't need to repeat myself.

Spoon, Toda are hybrid tri-Y's not standard Tri-Y and the Spoon is sequentially paired for upper rpms.

Mugen has a Gymkhana standard tri-Y and a 4-1 (comes in both 2.5 & 2 in. collectors: you have to specify which one you want).
 

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00tegGS-R on Feb/17/04 said:
Would the spec B toda's be a little much for a daily driver?
As far as tuning, I think the VAFC2 good considering NA.
And I have relatively cheap labour available to me...

how much do aftermarket cams mess with fuel consumption? Especially the higher lift ones like the B's?
you need to go with a full ECU reporgram..the VAFC2 or any piggyback is not going to cut it. Not enough resolution as was stated in the CT's thread and there's no ECU ignition tables reprogramming .

depends on where you put the VTEC switchover with those cams and a JDM style header too. VAFC's can't have a VTEC at > 7000 rpm.


if you're thinking of fuel consumption then don't try to go for 200 whp. It's sort of a moot discussion then. The only way you get to a peak power goal is to add more air. If you don't, you won't get to your goal. If you add more air, then if you don't add enough fuel: KABOOM.

I suggest you peruse the CT's topics first so we can prevent rehashing things like dynamic CR for cam choice, engine packaging, gearing and powerband releationships, reprogramming topics. thanks
 
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