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so i was talking to my friends and they said in order to reach your top speed you need to double clutch.. frist thing is, is this true? second is what is double clutching and what are all the other clutching techniques?? thanks
 

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" It's like granny shifting except that you actually let the clutch out when you're in neutral, bring up the engine RPMs again, then push in the clutch and go into the next gear. And you do it all VERY fast. This was especially necessary on older cars before synchro gears smoothed the processes of changing gears in the gearbox. It is also a way to avoid grinding gears on transmissions that have been damaged by powershifting too much. "

Taken from:
http://www.10w40.com/

Shift types would be.
Powershifting, grannyshifting, and double-clutching.

You can read what they all are at the site I listed.

- Josh
 

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^^ Do you really think that movie invented the term?

Do you think noone double clutched before that movie came out, and it was all fabricated for the sake of "ricerdom"?

Cmon, be constructive and add something related to his question, not more of this "F&F" stuff. Like I said before much of that movie was put into dialog because people were doing it ... if only that movie hadnt come out I dont know what you people would have to say about such questions...


- Josh
 

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built4speed on Apr/02/04 said:
^^ Do you really think that movie invented the term?

Do you think noone double clutched before that movie came out, and it was all fabricated for the sake of "ricerdom"?

Cmon, be constructive and add something related to his question, not more of this "F&F" stuff. Like I said before much of that movie was put into dialog because people were doing it ... if only that movie hadnt come out I dont know what you people would have to say about such questions...


- Josh
He said that because that's probably where most people heard the term. No need to get all defensive.

Double clutching has been covered a bunch of times here...I'll give you the Cliff Notes though...

Don't do it, it slows you down, you have synchros so there is no need to do it.

Thanks.
 

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LOL if you actually know how silly you sound (i.e. double clutching on an upshift) you wouldn't be so indignant in your response because it isn't just the F&F part ...it's the brutal ignorance that is being displayed along with the arrogance together.

Stupid and arrogant at the same time is dangerous.
 

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MD, Who was that towards?

The first post I put up was a defintion taken from a website, I was not speaking personally from my own knowledge, that was why I referenced it - Cause I wasnt the one who wrote it. I simply responded to the second half of Stephen's post. I do not know what is has to do with topspeeds, so I refrained from commenting on that part.

And, JK - I wasnt being defensive, at least not in a mean way that would of warranted you closin the topic down. My fault if it came out wrong, but arent I entitled to my opinion on the matter just as he was to state his to begin with?

- Josh
 

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we used to double clutch on a downshift in the old days. no-one double clutches on the downshifts any more. It takes too much time. When we heel & toe in the Formula Reynards, I used to double clutch (just like in the old Austin Healey or Triumph MGB Hewland synchroless trannies ). My Sensei Ugo who instructs my race driving told me you waste too much time doing it and you will get beat into a corner entry braking zone. Remember this is in synchroless trannies. The tegs have synchros.

Here is the previous heel & toe thread where I lay out the proper heel & toe downshift rev matching that you need to do.


here's a nice video of my Sensei , Ugo Provencher , Instructor at the Panoz Bridgestone Racing Academy at Mosport .
 

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Yeah, I didnt mean for what I posted to come off as something he SHOULD do, I was simply answering what it was from what I found. Sorry.


- Josh
 

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I'm not sure, but I believe the only real advantage to double clutching in an integra with synchro's is to compensate for maybe having a really high powerband, though it would have to be damn high.
 

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you can believe whatever you want.you never need to double clutch these days even in a synchroless tranny, let alone on a tranny with synchros. you never need to double clutch on an upshift ever. that whole notion was created by ignoramuses who know nothing about racing.


when you get passed because you are coasting while fumbling to double clutch, the other guy has finished his downshift and started to the apex and is throttling earlier than you. Get passed enough times and you ditch this whole notion of having to double clutch. Trust me, at 160 mph and braking down to 60 mph you don't have a hell of a lot of time to fumble around. that's 3 double clutches for 3 downshifts from 4th to 3rd to 2nd to 1st in a racing Hewland box. Remember we're talking tenths of seconds and no time to blink under stress from an opponent who wants to take your place away from you in a race (dog eat dog).
 

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and the original post said WHAT about a racetrack?
stephen i doubt your car is currently capable of 160mph, but anyways, your question is one that there is much misunderstanding about.
search around...you'll find writeups about your questions.
 

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you don't double clutch on an upshift...do you know why you double clutch in the first place? ever tried shifting a tranny with no synchros? even then in a tranny with no synchros we upshift without double clutching and sometimes if we get the rpms right we upshift without a clutch being engaged (powershift).

the difference between the crankshaft speed and driveshaft speed is more pronounced when you have to slow down and downshift. secondly when you downshift you don't want any engine braking from mismathed rpms to unsettle the car's handling balance...the weight shifts too far forward and so you rev match by using the heel and toe method to prevent that ...you don't double clutch during the heel & toe procedure any more, since it takes time and you slow down too much because those extra tenths of coasting while double clutching kills you. your opponent will downshift faster than you and set up inside of you while you are dicking around double clutching. third point, we heel & toe downshift to keep the rpms in the powerband and not let it drop out of the powerband.

it's really annoying to see people who have no clue about what they are saying and never having done it at any racetrack speaking as though they are authorities on the topic. To people who have done it and were formally trained you look like a pathetic bunch of quacks.

The one thing this board shouldn't become is run over by stunnas and "the F&F crew". We should chase these people outa here.
 

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stephendawafa on Apr/02/04 said:
so i was talking to my friends and they said in order to reach your top speed you need to double clutch..


(thanks to SurferX for this pic: it's so apropos)


tell your friend to stop getting his info from wherever he's getting it because he's lost in space.


that movie has done nothing good for the sport compact car movement. those same people have virtually made the motorcycle scene look as pathetically stupid when they did that movie Torque (yeah a 1L V twin has lotsa torque...)
 

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thanks for setting the record straight MD and thank you SUrferX the pic is still making me laugh

btw ... i have jewish tuner friends who are offended that you make the insinuation that all jewish tuners good to the good book "f&f" to get info ...LOL
 
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